The Monday night meeting blog was written by guest blogger Lori Wightman. Thank you Lori!
My first time back in actual town hall (I think) and it was like I had never left.
When I first got there, early, there were only a couple of people there and a lot of empty seats but that changed when people interested in the delegation and the decision about adding a gymnasium to the new fire hall started to trickle in. Adults and kids, some with signs all filed in and filled every available seat and some standing area spots. I think there were even people out in the lobby.
The first thing I noticed was the increase in the number of women in leadership positions – always good to see.
All of council was in attendance and the minutes of the previous meeting were accepted with no corrections.
The first (and only) delegation – Joe Thachen-Cary from the Amherstburg Indoor Sports Association (AISA) spoke in support of the Proposed Fire Hall and Gymnasium plans for design and tender as laid out in the agenda under 12.1.
For a refresher or for those who don’t know what the recommendation is:
1. RECOMMENDATION:
It is recommended that:
1. The project proceed utilizing a Design-Bid-Build project delivery model with the following recommendations:
2. The Mayor and Chief Administrative Officer or designates, BE AUTHORIZED to execute an agreement with the sole bidder Masri O Architects in the amount of $511,300 plus HST including all labour and materials to produce a full set of Design Construction Documents inclusive of project tendering for a new Fire Station at the Libro centre inclusive of $97,000 to include plans for a gymnasium and further;
3. Council APPROVE an expenditure in the amount of $261,300, plus nonrefundable HST, which is required for the overage on the Fire Station costs in the amount of $164,300 and to allow for the inclusion of gymnasium design in the amount of $97,000, and DIRECT the Chief Financial Officer to report back to Council on the recommended funding source and further;
4. The Chief Administrative Officer, BE AUTHORIZED to sign or take any such actions required to execute the preparation of Design Construction Documents suitable for tender for the implementation of the new Fire Station and Gymnasium, satisfactory in legal form to the Clerk, in technical content to the Fire Chief and the Director of Parks Facilities, Recreation and Culture and in financial content to the Director of Corporate Services and further; and,
5. The final Design/Tender documents BE BROUGHT BACK to Council for approval to then select a general contractor for the construction of the new facility through a comprehensive tendering process.
Mr. Thachen-Cary spoke very succinctly and with quite a bit of factual knowledge about the need for a public gym in Amherstburg. His association has over 300 players – some who play daily, some who play 2-4 times a week and some who play weekly – all playing a wide variety of sports including volleyball, basketball, pickleball etc. and from all different age groups. These players pay lots of user fees and currently all those fee payments are going to other municipalities because Amherstburg doesn’t have gym facilities. He pointed out that league volleyball players alone number at least 1200 in the county.
He said they are forced to go to other municipalities and that those municipalities get those user fees. He said if Amherstburg had the facilities not only would they be getting user fees but users would reduce their carbon footprint, but they’d save gas money leaving them more discretionary spending for local businesses in and around the town. It would enhance sport tourism in town, and encourage the development of our hotel.
The user fees generated is in the area of $170,000 – 200,000 a year which is more than enough to recoup the cost of adding the gym to the plans. In addition, AISA would also be instrumental in bringing advertisers to town. He felt that the consulting fees shouldn’t be a deal breaker.
Councillor Renaud asked if Admin had reviewed these figures and if they were realistic. Ms. Baillargeon from Parks and Rec said that the programming from AISA would be enough to produce these figures steadily.
Deputy Mayor Meloche asked if we couldn’t just enter into an agreement with the new school to use their gym. Ms. Baillargeon said it has been discussed but that the time of use from the school would be limited, it wouldn’t be full time, daily or when it was needed necessarily.
Deputy Mayor Meloche then asked how much money was on the table right now for Purdy and Centennial Parks and how much “you” are intending on spending there.
ASIDE : I don’t like it when council members use this wording. Administration is not intending to do anything, council makes those decisions. Using this wording is misleading to the average person watching meetings and pushes the belief that admin is steering the boat and to blame for spending.
Ms. Baillargeon stated that it was up to council but ball park is about $4 million for each park depending on what amenities are included where. The Deputy Mayor then talked about how it would be $10 million to bare bones both parks and wondered how much we had precommitted. Councillor McArthur stepped in to say all recreational wants and needs are multimillion ones and that $97,000 to add a gym to the plans is just a design. What savings were there by getting in on the ground floor with plans now.
Ms. Baillargeon said it was an opportunity – that if you don’t plan ahead you lose out on an opportunity. You need a strategy to get things in your plan and the design is a place to start.
ASIDE: Not to sound too much like Sarah but had you all adopted the Libro Master Plan you’d have a clear pathway forward and know next steps and what is needed now, tomorrow, next year and next decade. But you didn’t and now you want to short these plans as well. You don’t have to do anything with them – but having them gives you a path forward and saves the cost if you then choose to do it in the future.
Councillor Courtney then spoke and said he had “lots of questions”.
Listening to “Joe’s” plan – which Councillor Courtney liked – he wondered if the cost recovery for maintenance etc. was breakeven. Admin and Mr. Thachen-Cary said it was realistic. Ms. Baillargeon said that looking at the programming and its users it was viable.
ASIDE: Another thingI find offputting is this habit of some councillor’s when they refer to delegates or admin so informally by their first names. It flies in the face of the formality of council and, if I’m honest, seems a little disrespectful. This isn’t your backyard bonfire party – it’s council chambers.
Councillor Courtney thought the cost of the plans at $500,000 was shocking and wondered what the cost savings would be if we did the drawings now vs. later. Fire Chief Montone replied that the cost saving would likely be about 75% if we did the plans now
ASIDE: Which makes sense – now it would be an add on to the plans already being done, later it would be entirely new plans done from scratch.
Councillor Courtney then asked why we could just use the school gyms and appease everyone. (This question was already asked and answered but alas….) The delegate responded that coaches in school already fight for gym time and that the school usage would always get priority over public usage. He reiterated that the times the gym would be available for the public would be limited to outside school hours and if Amherstburg were to complete this fire hall gymnasium it’s likely that schools would be asking to use it occasionally to alleviate their congestion.
Councillor Courtney then wondered if we started a league will we take kids from other municipalities (and if we did? Our kids have been going to other towns all along, why is the reverse even an issue?) Mr. Thachen-Cary said we would not be cannibalising, we are bringing our kids back home. (What a great statement!). He said that we’d be able to have provincial tournaments, house leagues. He said that there are lots of groups that use school gyms and historical users get preference and that the pandemic has shown us that user agreements can be nullified at any time.
Councillor Renaud asked what amount of participants would come back to Amherstburg – the answer was 1700 or so and that we would know better once concrete plans were in place.
Deputy Mayor Meloche spoke about somewhat specifics in that we’ve committed $5 million debt to water, Heidi needs $10 million for parks, Bruce wants $3 million for a fire hall (double whammy there – first names and putting the expenditures on admin) and $2 million to a gym. Can the town handle this debt? Administration said this is just for the plans and that council would be in no way committing funds to building. The Deputy Mayor then asked if we commit to the $15 million, what is the debt? Administration said that if council committed to it and put it through debt it would be about $500,000/year.
Councillor Prue asked if the gym would be built in conjunction with the fire hall and when would that happen? Chief Montone responded that it was not determined yet but first this design spending would be approved, then the design itself, the tender and then the awarding of the tender. But he hopes shovels in the ground should happen in 2023 or 2024.
Councillor Prue said that we would need to find money for this and was concerned about what other recreational programs would be pushed back. Ms. Baillargeon said that the design needs to be approved and then council will approve the building and other recreational items. Councillor Prue then said when people ask him again, “When am I getting a pool” the answer will likely be “looks like never”
ASIDE:Council has had 4 entire budgets to work towards getting a pool and no one, including Councillor Prue, has ever put forward any kind of motion, plan, wish, recommendation, idea or anything to get one. Bringing it up now seems a case of too little too late or maybe a bit of election posturing.
Mayor DiCarlo asked how much of the $10 million earmarked for parks (there isn’t a real figure earmarked but…) will go toward indoor sports. Ms. Baillargeon said there are no indoor sports plans for Purdie or Centennial parks.
Councillor Courtney brought up again how shocked he was at the $500,000 price tag for the plans, he wondered if we weren’t just reinventing the wheel, couldn’t we use plans from the City of Windsor since they just built 4 new halls. Chief Montone then explained that the plans in question have been significantly decreased from their original price and that the City of Windsor has engineers, project planners, structural engineers etc in house. We don’t have that so we have to pay for those jobs to be done once the architectural designs are done. We did use references from other municipalities (he mentioned Springwater Township who did almost exactly the same plan that what we want.)
Councillor Courtney wanted to know why we couldn’t just use Springwater’s plans. Ms. Baillargeon said we have to look at this unique to our build – streets, traffic, drainage, topography etc.
Then Councillor Courtney said we have all these plans that we haven’t really done. He spoke about a facility needs study and that town hall wasn’t AODA compliant. He said we “are free-wheeling all over the place”. (And yet, when you had the chance to adopt a plan for the LIbro, you chose not to….weird)
The motion went to a recorded vote…but then people kept debating….
Deputy Mayor Meloche wanted to put this forward for the 2023 budget since the $97,000 wasn’t budgeted for. Councillor McArthur pointed out that council hadn’t budgeted enough for just the fire station. Councillor Prue wanted to know when everything was coming back to council for approval. Admin said before council becomes lame duck. The Mayor pointed out that we are working with a 3rd party so we can’t control them and can’t guarantee timelines. Chief Montone said the 3rd party was extremely aware of the timeline so it shouldn’t be a problem. Councillor Prue said we can’t stop the process once it’s begun (I may be wrong but this is just for design plans – if council wanted they could get the plans and shove ‘em in a box somewhere, there is no commitment to going forward)
Finally, the vote…
Support – McArthur, Meloche, Prue, Renaud, Simone, DiCarlo
Against – Courtney
With that, the delegate and all the supporters left and we moved on in the agenda.
8.1 IT Data Centre Award of Tender
This was approved with no real discussion
9. No reports from Parks & Rec
10.1 Amherstburg Water Treatment Plant Upgrades
Councillor Prue had some questions about whether it said the figures were in the 2022 budget and if it was an error. It wasn’t. He asked if there was a positive variance. Admin said there was. Councillor Prue was concerned we were taking more money out of reserves, water rates etc that we needed. Administration clarified that if we needed less, we would take less from reserves. There was a long discussion to clarify for Councillor Prue (should have been a phone call) that if the actual cost is less then we don’t need to take as much from reserves.
And the recommendation was approved.
10.2 Pike Road Improvements
This was approved with no real discussion. Drainage Board minutes approved.
Unfinished Business
Councillor Courtney said he would bring up something about the ACS building under New Business.
Councillor Prue asked about the First Nations Flag – will we have the flag by Sept 30 for Truth and Reconciliation Day. Administration said they were working with an Indigenous group to see what THEY wanted. Councillor Prue asked again if it would be done by Sept 30. Administration said that it will likely be but it depends on what the group would like.
Councillor Prue asked about the Kingsbridge parkland conveyance, outstanding for 2 years. $66,000 seems low compared to what lots are going for. Administration noted that it is the amount put into the agreement and that it went to the Parks committee.
Councillor Courtney wanted to know about his audit request and the one for year end. Admin said the councillor requested one will come up at the special meeting on July 25 and that the year-end one will be at the August 8 meeting.
Councillor Prue asked if council can get a copy of the Deloitte report with all their recommendations to see where council is at in regards to them. (shouldn’t council already have access to that report?)
And with that we moved on to New Business (almost done, almost done)
Councillor Courtney asked about the silent auction at the old ACS building. He wondered what is going on with that and what are we getting rid of? Administration said it was an auction of miscellaneous items that the town is not in need of any longer. The ACS building is being used for ease of parking. Councillor Courtney reiterated that the kitchen was not being auctioned. It is not.
Motion from Councillor Courtney, seconded by Councillor Prue to bring results of the Jack Purdie and Centennial Park survey to council. Councillor Courtney said there were a lot of people who haven’t seen the results and are used to seeing them in agenda form and that it was time to make a decision on these two parks. (Seems odd that a decision couldn’t have already been made and that it seems now to be somewhat dependent on a survey completed by a few hundred people).
Councillor Simone asked for a fulsome report for the Aug. 8 meeting and Administration said there will be a report with recommendations by that time.
Councillor Renaud said we need to make a decision on direction.
All voted in favour.
Deputy Mayor Meloche spoke about the Co-An Park Steam Engine parade that needed police assistance which is somewhat tricky because of the responsibility lying between both municipalities – Amherstburg and Essex. Mayor DiCarlo said it was already taken care of.
Councillor McArthur brought up Duffy’s. He said last time it was discussed we were waiting for approvals and that he had spoken to Chris Lewis, our local MP, who said to send him some info and he would look into it to see if he could expedite anything. Councillor McArthur suggested we also reach out to our new MPP Anthony Leardi as well so they can both keep an eye out for government funding and such.
All the bylaws were approved and at 7:40 we were done!!
Thank goodness, I was worried that this would be one of those marathon meetings and I would question my sanity in saying that I would guest blog this meeting.
I’m back now! Thanks again to Lori Wightman for covering this meeting! I really appreciate that someone is willing to guest blog when I am unable to and can provide their insight and perspective to the sometimes very odd happenings during town council meetings. I may need to take another night off again in the future? LOL!!!
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